|
|
|
Comment |
Sorted by
Date Written |
Hurrah for "H" (Reply to this comment)
by msmarques
I realize you wrote this a long time ago, but I still see people getting upset over their "H" rating. I just read a post by someone who deleted all his "H" reviews feeling they just weren't good enough (even when they were the only review on a product).
Your article should be mandatory reading to those people. There's nothing wrong with an "H" rating. OK, maybe there are things that could be better, but "H" is pretty darn good.
Sure, I prefer to get VH ratings, but I want to deserve them. I think I learn the most from SH pieces I write, because then the raters are more likely to leave comments, by which I understand how to be more helpful.
|
May 10 '04
9:25 pm PDT
|
|
Re: Huzzah. (Reply to this comment)
by Vormancian
****What's your opinion to me? A lot, that's what. I haven't been active here all that long, and I haven't read a ton of your reviews, but I've quickly developed great respect for your writing and analysis skills.****
That's one of the nicest things anyone has said to me here, and (extremely humbly) it's not as though it were the only nice thing anyone ever said. ;)
****If you H'd me after everyone else VH'd me, I would wonder why (particularly after you just confessed to being an easy VH!), certainly not in the spirit of, "How dare you?" but in the spirit of, "I really wanted to impress you, what could I have done better?"****
I think the key here is when you point out the spirit in which you would mean it. Sort of like the difference between if you care what I think, and if you CARE what I think. Of course, it is only natural that one would wonder in this sense, but I was aiming at those people who CARE.
****That's one of my goals when I write a review (right behind helping people make buying decisions)-- to impress the people who impress me.****
If that were the goal of more people here, the whole place would probably work a lot better. I remember when I first started writing here, the person I was first and most impressed with was Sloucho. He is simply a fantastic writer, and unfortunately he doesn't really write here anymore. He added me to his WOT, not even because of a review I wrote, but because of a comment I left on one of his reviews. He said something like, when someone leaves a comment that is better than the review it is a comment on, that person gets added to my WOT. Something along those lines anyway. I think it was, oddly, a review of Best Buy. Anyway, it was definitely a good feeling to have him impressed with what I wrote, so I know just what you mean.
****Just by coincidence, I've read a lot today on the evils of cookie-cutter opinions that give a lot of objective information (e.g., plot summary for a movie, or specs for a piece of electronic equipment) with little or no subjective reviewer experience. But let's not forget that it's possible to go too far toward the other end of the spectrum, and give a lot of personal opinion without enough objective information to give the reader a usable frame of reference.****
I think I disagree in a sense, but it may only be because I'm not completely clear on your position here. What I mean is, my basic point is that a review that is all plot synopsis cannot be VH. That is pretty much the end of the story. Now you say that it is possible to go too far the other way. That is, all subjective information, no objective information. It's tricky even to be sure what this means, unless we mean complete garbage reviews, because there has to be some objective information just to be able to give a subjective opinion. Where I am leaning toward disagreeing though, is that my point is that the one direction is necessarily not a good review, and the other direction is not. A review that is all subjective opinion can still be a good review, though it is difficult, but a review all objective information cannot.
I think I over explained that at this point. ;)
****I've read reviews that go on for entire paragraphs about how much the reviewer loved/hated the product, but never gave me anything that I could use to determine whether I would also love/hate it. I still find myself asking at the end, "Yes, but should I see it?"****
As have we all certainly. ;)
****Inflated ratings are a real problem, and I couldn't agree more with your point of how overuse of the VH rating tarnishes its worth. I'm a tough rater for that reason-- I try to only give VH if I think a review is truly in the top tier of all reviews I've ever read here, and as a result, I give a lot of Hs. The surprising thing is how hard it is to give an H when you're looking at that column of VHs, and feeling like a jerk for dissing a perfectly good review. Well, it WAS a perfectly good review... it just wasn't superb. Not every review can be superb.****
Absolutely true, it can be hard. Especially if you generally get to review after fifty or more people have already been there. I think the thing here is to have some very clear guidelines about what you think a review needs in order to be a VH, and then not to stick to them. ;)
Seriously, I think you've got to have a good framework, but guidelines are only guidelines. I mean, rating a review is as subjective as the review itself. It's just your opinion of the opinion, and even though Epinions has their own guidelines, even they are only guidelines.
When you rate a lot of things H that have been rated VH, some people will go mad, and some people will understand, and that's about all there is to it.
Thanks for the comment.
|
Oct 24 '03
11:09 am PDT
|
|
Huzzah. (Reply to this comment)
by tesseract
What's your opinion to me? A lot, that's what. I haven't been active here all that long, and I haven't read a ton of your reviews, but I've quickly developed great respect for your writing and analysis skills. If you H'd me after everyone else VH'd me, I would wonder why (particularly after you just confessed to being an easy VH!), certainly not in the spirit of, "How dare you?" but in the spirit of, "I really wanted to impress you, what could I have done better?" That's one of my goals when I write a review (right behind helping people make buying decisions)-- to impress the people who impress me.
Just by coincidence, I've read a lot today on the evils of cookie-cutter opinions that give a lot of objective information (e.g., plot summary for a movie, or specs for a piece of electronic equipment) with little or no subjective reviewer experience. But let's not forget that it's possible to go too far toward the other end of the spectrum, and give a lot of personal opinion without enough objective information to give the reader a usable frame of reference. I've read reviews that go on for entire paragraphs about how much the reviewer loved/hated the product, but never gave me anything that I could use to determine whether I would also love/hate it. I still find myself asking at the end, "Yes, but should I see it?"
Inflated ratings are a real problem, and I couldn't agree more with your point of how overuse of the VH rating tarnishes its worth. I'm a tough rater for that reason-- I try to only give VH if I think a review is truly in the top tier of all reviews I've ever read here, and as a result, I give a lot of Hs. The surprising thing is how hard it is to give an H when you're looking at that column of VHs, and feeling like a jerk for dissing a perfectly good review. Well, it WAS a perfectly good review... it just wasn't superb. Not every review can be superb.
Tess
|
Oct 20 '03
5:58 pm PDT
|
|
Re: Great point... (Reply to this comment)
by Vormancian
Very good insights, and I hope you have a good experience here.
Cheers.
|
Aug 06 '03
10:27 am PDT
|
|
Great point... (Reply to this comment)
by lch3778
Once, many moons ago I belonged to this little site called knowpost.com which I loved to death. Unfortunately it died a terrible death and I've been on the lookout for a replacement so hopefully this community will be that place. I find it interesting that this is almost a rehash of an argument we used to have on kp all the time. There you were rated by stars, no stars bad, 5 stars outstanding, and everything in between. If you gave someone less than 5 stars for answering your question there were a lot of people who would get really upset. Like you, I never got that. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. We even used to have a name for a person who'd rate people low just to tick them off, we called them the meanie marker. They didn't rate you with any consistency, they'd rate the first answers they got with 5 stars and draw more people into answering the question then slap everyone else with no stars or 1 star. And we took it quite personally. We'd get up in our public forum, the soapbox, and rant and rave at what an evil person this was since people could post anonymously. In the end, we all want people to like our work but lets face facts, it's not gonna happen. I'll just be grateful and flattered if people read my opinions. Beyond that, it'll all sort itself out.
|
Aug 05 '03
8:06 am PDT
|
|
.. (Reply to this comment)
by fyvel
Well, I stumbled upon this while going through some of your older works :) Not everybody ignores all but the 5 newest!
Great review!
~Mandy
|
Jan 16 '02
7:37 pm PST
|
|
Re: Well+said! (Reply to this comment)
by ifif1938
couldn't have said it better myself....I thank you for adding me to your WOT and after reading a few of yours have added you to mine....That does not mean you will always get Very Helpful.LOL, :) but, from what I have read, you are deserving of them.I would still like to know though why I received a SH from someone when I wrote my "goodbye, I'm going to the hospital review". It was just my way of saying to everyone that I would be gone from epinions for a while...
Anyway, I'm being too serious now, but that really bugged me....
Thanks again
Barbara
|
Jun 22 '01
3:09 pm PDT
|
|
Well said! (Reply to this comment)
by amysmum
And I think the point about reading earlier reviews is important as people probably start with the things they are passionate about.
Catriona
|
Jun 16 '01
1:05 am PDT
|
|
great points...... (Reply to this comment)
by pansy4agirl
and actually, sometimes it's lots of fun to go back and read some "older" work -
in my situation, and just so that nobody has to open up two or more pages to see the things I have written in the past, and also so that the articles are not "dated" - I list them, by categories, in my profile as links - if they want to seen where they fall in the "chronologic" of it all, they can just click on the "see more of xx's reviews" above....
just a thought - to maybe bring people to older reviews....
enjoyed reading this, and congrats on your 100th Epinion!
~justme
|
Jun 16 '01
1:02 am PDT
|
|
Re: All (Reply to this comment)
by Vormancian
It's an email newsletter. I usually just call it a newsletter, but ezine is the popular internet name for such things.
Thanks everyone for the comments.
|
Jun 15 '01
7:48 am PDT
|
|
All (Reply to this comment)
by bperreault
Made sense to me. I,too, have a few or more earlier opinions that deserve H or even SH. So what the heck, I am not a professional and am learning. One or 2 H's among all the VH's? I figure it could be revenge or they just didn't like it. It is OK with me; I tried my best.
BTW, what is ezine??? Looked it up in 2 dictionaries.
|
Jun 14 '01
1:56 pm PDT
|
|
Re: Well,+me+too (Reply to this comment)
by lisaatucla
Yes & me too, I agree. First with movie ratings, some writers do not explain WHY I should go to see the movie or WHAT specifically they like about it. On the flipside, I like to read about a plot and some of the main characters. Secondly, if people expect to only get VH, then how will they ever improve their writing? They must feel like their writing needs no improvement. Nice rant, entertained & informed me. Now what about the socks advice? Epinions has a category for socks?
|
Jun 14 '01
10:30 am PDT
|
|
Well, me too (Reply to this comment)
by Roov
I don't have anything different to add in this comment, just that I agree with you too. Some excellent points in this article.
Thanks!
|
Jun 14 '01
8:56 am PDT
|
|
This essay certainly deserves a 'Very Helpful' (Reply to this comment)
by grimjack2
This is a great article. Like your lack of desire to learn about how to choose socks, I tend not to read all these reviews about how to rate other Epinions. I read the company's FAQ, and have come to my own decision how I intend to judge the reviews I read. However, I read this one, and am glad to know that there is someone else out there who feels the way I do.
I too feel that many Epinion veterans expect to get their VH only because they have received so many before. I unfortunately feel that many people expect to only get VH from people they've trusted. I also feel that some people get offended way too easy about anything less than a VH. When someone gives me less than I thought I deserved, I will usually email them and ask what I did or didn't do to get that ranking. Especially if this is an advisor, because they may actually teach me something. And if they only voted it a Helpful due to its length, this time they might actually read it and give it a more appropriate rating now that they've been personally invited to re-read it.
One of the other important things you mentioned far too briefly in this article is that people with hundreds of reviews can't seem to get people to go back and read their earlier work. I only have about 80 epinions, and like everyone else, my earliest was clearly not my best work. I even went back and rewrote some of them, sent out invitations through my trust list, and still can't get more than 3 or 4 ratings.
Since I am still somewhat new here, and only trust a handful of people so far, I have made it a point to go back and re-read some earlier work of anyone whose newest work I particularly like. I hope I never get burned out and only read what I catch in the 'just in' section, like so many others seem to be.
|
Jun 14 '01
6:27 am PDT
|
|
Good job, Marc! (Reply to this comment)
by Yzerman
I don't know why people get offended by getting an "Helpful". It is a good rating, but like you said, people think you shot their dog or something. And I totally agree with your example of a movie review where there is only a plot summary. I want to know what people thought about the movie more than I want a plot summary.
You made some great points!
Diane
|
Jun 14 '01
5:03 am PDT
|
|
Good points and (Reply to this comment)
by Lisa_J
very true!
Upon recently assigning a Helpful to a seasoned epinionator -- she/he has stopped rating my epinions. This person doesn't like to receive anything other than VH's.
I always strive toward composing a VH article, but realize that people differ in their assesment system.
Take care!
lisa_j
|
Jun 14 '01
12:24 am PDT
|
|
I agree totally (Reply to this comment)
by phungus
Some people act like if you give them anything OTHER than a VH, you might as well rate them as NH. They act insulted.
My biggest problem is people who go on and on about something that could be much more simplified.
|
Jun 14 '01
12:01 am PDT
|
|
|
|
