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Re: Facts (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
That doesnt answer a single question I posed in the review. Boyer and and Franklin were five feet nothing. Sam cooke was over six feet tall, how in god's name could they done all of that damage to cooke? And without having a scratch on them?
and again, it is medically impossible for Cooke to have died the way the police say he did. He was either shot because bertha was scared of him, or he was beaten to death by two women who, by your logic, were both good enough fighters to be even money against Ali.
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Oct 24 '09
2:40 am PDT
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Facts (Reply to this comment)
by deltalady
Both Lisa and Bertha were charged and tried for Sam Cooke's murder and both were acquitted. It was determined that his death was justifiable homicide. As for his family not wanting to investigate further, his widow actually hired an investigator who uncovered (among other facts) the fact that he was beaten so badly that he was nearly decapitated. This was not a "whitey" conspiracy as you would imply. This was a man (Cooke) who stepped on people on his way up the ladder (as we all unfortunately do) and stepped on the wrong person. OR this was a man who was dating the wrong woman. Lisa, who was arrested not a month after his death for prostitution incidentally, was convicted of killing her boyfriend in 1979. Bertha moved out of state after the trial and died not 2 years later.
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Oct 21 '09
5:44 am PDT
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PICK A NEW PROFESSION (Reply to this comment)
by thebeliever
THE POT CAN NOT CALL THE KETTLE BLACK..I AM SURE THAT YOUR BACK YARD IS NOT CLEAN..IF SAM GOT LOCKED OUT OF OUT OF THE ROOM, HE HAS A BIG HOUSE AND A WIFE IN IT HE WOULD HAVE WENT HOME..WHO WOULD HAVE KNOWN THAT HE WAS HALF DRESSED..SAM DID NOT HAVE TIME FOR FOOLISHNESS..IF HE GOT LOCKED OUT OF THE ROOM WHAT IN THE HELL DID HE WALK OUT FOR..(MESSAGE) HE WAS NOT ALONE AND IF HE THERE FELT THAT STANGE AND ALREADY HAD A WAY OUT HE IS FAMOUS, HE WILL NOT BE GOING TO A WRONGE DOOR TAKING A CHANCE THAT SOMEONE MAY SEE HIM..HE HAD ONE OF THE MOST HIGH PERFORMANCE CARS IN THE WORLD..HE WOULD HAVE LEFT WITH TIRES SMOKING..EVIDENTLY HE WAS NOT THERE FOR SEX..(BAC)AS YOU CLAIM WAS SO HIGH HIS WOULD NOT ALLOW HIS TO SOLUTE..HE WAS LURED INTO A TRAP BY THIS FEMALE..AND ONCE HE WENT INSIDE THAT WAS IT..WAS THERE A SEARCH WARRENT TO SEARCH ALL THE ROOMS FOR EVIDENCE NO..SO HE WAS SET UP AND MURDERED AND UNDRESSED SO IT WOULD LOOK LIKE HE WAS CRAZY..NOW BACK THEN THAT WAS ALL (PO PO) NEEDED TO SEE..THEY WAS TOO HAPPY TO SEE A PROMINENT BLACK MAN DOWN..AND MOST LIKELY (PO PO) WAS A REGULAR AROUND THAT FILTHY PLACE..NOW IF SAM WAS GOING TO GO TO A MOTEL IT DAMN SURE WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THERE..BECAUSE IF SHE WAS ANY KIND OF WOMEN AND SHE IS WITH A FAMOUS RICH MAN HE IS GOING TO SPEND THAT MONEY..IF THAT WAS ME I WOULD HAVE GUARDED THAT MAN LIKE THE POPE..NOW AUTOPSY PICK ANOTHER PROFESSION BECAUSE YOU ARE EITHER TIRED OR INSANE TO SAY THE FINDING ARE CONSISTENT..I WONDER HOW MUCH GOT PAID TO POST YOUR COWARD!!!! DO NOT DIRTY HIS NAME AND I HOPE HIS SPIRIT HAUNTS YOU INTO EXCEPTING GOD AS YOUR LORD AND SAVIOR..BECAUSE YOUR ARE BLIND TO ALL THIS EVIDENCE..WHAT'S THAT MATTER YOU WANTED TO BE SAM..GET A BUSINESS...BLESS YOU!!!!
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Sep 17 '09
1:11 am PDT
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Re: Re: Re: Dr. Muhammad Speaks (Reply to this comment)
by thebeliever
YES FORENSIC, HAS ARRIVED..DID YOU DO THE AUTOPSY ON SAM..B.A.L. HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM BEING NAKED..THE HELL THAT HE WENT THROUGH I AM SHORE THAT HE SOBERED UP QUICK..SAM WAS NOT NEW TO WOMEN AND DRINKING..HE DID NOT CRASH HIS CAR SO HIS JUDGEMENT WAS FINE..THE EVIL DOERS FELT HE HAS A WEAKNESS FOR WOMEN..NOTICE HOW I SAID HAS..PAY ATTENTION..YES SAM IS A STAR AND GOVERNED HIM SELF AND THOSE AROUND HIM WITH CAUTION..AND HE STAYED CLEAN..BUT JUST LIKE ORDINARY PEOPLE HE TOO KNEW HIS LIMIT WITH DRINKING AND WOMEN..WHY CHANGE HISTORY YOU GOT IT TO CLEAR HIS NAME..YOU ACT LIKE YOU DID..AND YOU DID SAY COPS ARE TRAINED TO SHOOT ACURATE..I THOUGHT BERTHA CONFESSED TO IT ????.. HEART STOPS BLOOD COLLECTS IN DEPENDENT PARTS OF THE BODY (LIVOR MORTIS) EYES FIRST TO RIGIDIFY..BODY STIFF (RIGOR MORTIS) BODY COOLS (ALGOR MORTIS) LEARN SOMETHING !! RIGOR LETS UP AFTER 72 HOURS..YOU CAN POSITION THE BODY B 4 EMBALM..IF SAM WAS B.A.L WAS AS HIGH AS YOU SAY HE WOULD NOT HAVE TAKEN HIS CLOTHES OFF FOR SEX..HE WAS BEATEN WITH A BLUNT OBJECT AND PUT UP A FIGHT..KILLING SAM WAS NOT GOING TO BE EASY..TAKING HIS CLOTHES OFF HELD ALL THE BLOOD EVIDENCE..YES HES WAS BUSTED UP AND THEN SHOT UP AND THEN POSITIONED LIKE HE WAS A CRAZED ANIMAL WITH NO CLOTHES ON..THAT WAS PERSONAL AND IT SENT A MESSAGE..THAT SOMEONE OR SOME PERSONS WANTED TO BE IN SAM SHOES..TWO MONKEYS COULD HAVE DONE BETTER..SO WE DO NOT NEED TO GO BACK IN TIME WE NEVER SHELVED HIM..SO COPS ARE TRAINED TO SHOOT CENTER MASS..THIS FAKE SET UP WAS NOT A ROBBERY..AND THE WOMEN WHO TOOK PART HAD A GREATER FEAR OF WHAT COULD HAPPEN TO THEM IF THEY DID NOT DO WHAT THEY WERE TOLD..IF SAM ONLY HAD HIS SUIT JACKET ON AND SHOES HE COULD HAVE STAYED IN HIS CAR AND KEPT ON TRUCKING BECAUSE THE MONEY THAT THEY TOOK WAS PEANUTS TO SAM..THE EVIL DOERS DID HIM BEFORE HE GOT..CHECK THIS OUT IF YOU WERE BEST FRIENDS WITH (ALI) YOU TO WILL KNOW HOW TO KICK A LOT OF TAIL..SO I COULD SLEEP GOOD AT NIGHT HOW ABOUT YOU AND THE EVIL DOERS..BEST BELIVE THE BODY MAY DIE BUT THE SPIRIT LIVES ON YOU WILL SEE....BLESS... YOU MIND YOUR BUSINESS..B 4 U GET LOOKED AT..BECAUSE IT TOOK A FEW PEOPLE KICK HIS BUT..THEN TURN PUNK AND SHOT HIM...NO ROBBER OR ROBBERS HAVE KNOW TIME TO DO THIS UNLESS THEY ARE IN A CONTROLED ENVIREMENT..THIS WAS A SPECIAL ORDER...HELLO
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Sep 16 '09
11:07 pm PDT
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Re: Re: Dr. Muhammad Speaks (Reply to this comment)
by opd652
Yes forensics are better now. But what many overlook is the fact that his blood alcohol was almost twice the legal limit. Alcohol impaired his judgement. He made a mistake that cost him his life. Millions of other people have done the same thing. The only difference is they're average people and not world reknowned singers. Accept the fact he was a great singer and move on. The investigation can be reopened, but what's the point of changing history years afterward, just to eliminate the black cloud surrounding his death. Insofar as Etta James' statements, anyone with a background in pathology would realize what was going on. His hands were consistent with rigor. He skin had been degloved and his foregead folded over his nose to remove his brain during the autopsy. That's standard, and it makes people look that way before they are fixed by the mortician. Insofar as the shot, police are trained to shoot center mass, even then. The bullet had to go somewhere and it simply found it's way to a lethal spot. This mystery and conspiracy is neither. It's a tradgedy that perpetuated. Maybe if we had a time machine we could go back to see what truly happened. Absent that, it is what it is.
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Jun 11 '08
12:24 am PDT
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Re: Uncle Sam (Reply to this comment)
by opd652
I was told that he had been locked out by accident and while trying to get back into his room he went to the wrong window and was shot! The things we hear as a kid. The sad truth is, no man is sacrosanct, not even Sam Cooke. He was involved in an adulterous affair with a woman of ill repute. He had been drinking with a BAC of .14% and was shot and killed.
He was autopsied. I've been to several dozen autopsies. The appearance post mortem is consistent with that.
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Jun 11 '08
12:15 am PDT
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Sam Cooke (Reply to this comment)
by oldiesfan60
I was 16 at the time of Sam Cookes death and from what reports we got for the times, I did not then nor do I now believe that he was not setup somehow. Since the computer age, I have read that he was badly beaten and almost decapitated. How sad is that? It makes me cry as I think that man had the greatest voice ever. My mother wasn't like some of my friends parents, whereas I could listen to music from black artists. She too was a big Sam Cooke fan and Brook Benton. Heck, she liked them better then Elvis. I had every 45 that was out from the time I was 6 until you couldn't get them anymore. There has to be a way for us to find out the truth. Sam needs to rest in peace which I am sure he isn't. I was told at an early age if there is unfinished buisness a soul will not cross over so therefore Sam may still be here. Someone needs to listen if he is still here. My grandmother told me that when I was a little girl. If he has crossed over, I am sure my mother is hanging out with him and all the greats from that era. She hated the new age music. She died 20 years ago. God Bless all of them and I hope they are resting in peace.
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Oct 18 '07
1:00 pm PDT
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Re: Dr. Muhammad Speaks (Reply to this comment)
by oldiesfan60
I am curious as to what I have read saying that his face was bashed in, he had a broken nose, and his hands were broken like he was beaten to death. It sounds to me like a hate crime if it is true. It shouldn't matter that all the people involved are dead, there should be a way to find out the truth. The LA Police are famous for screw ups. I understand that forsenics are better now then they were 40 years ago. I am a big Sam Cooke fan and all the oldies. Thank God my mother let me have the 45's of the black artists in that era. Some of my friends weren't allowed so they would come to my house and listen to them, they knew my mother would buy me all of them, which she did. Is anyone sure that Sam is resting in peace, I don't think so. He needs to. It is sad to think, that because he was taking over his career, someone would kill him over it. I also read that the girl he had with him was arrested for prostitution shortley after. I can't believe that Sam would rape anyone. He was a good looking man and could probably get any girl he wanted. He was not ugly. I think someone should make the LAPD reopen the case and do what they have to do. I believe his family, fans and Sam himself should be able to finally put this to rest so that Sam can finally Rest In Peacae. God Bless Sam
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Oct 18 '07
12:48 pm PDT
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Death of Sam Cooke (Reply to this comment)
by oldiesfan60
For the times, I was a big fan and still am of Sam Cooke. I was young when he was killed but as a teen, it was discussed and to this day, I think because that Sam was an African American the police decided it was no big deal. I can read online the different stories written and it makes sense to me that there is a problem. With all the technology today, would it be possible to have him exhumed and the medical examiner, a reputable, do another autopsy? I think his family would say yes. I hate the thought of him being exhumed but someone should have to pay the penalty for killing a man who had the most beautiful voice in music history. I am 60 almost and when I was growing up, I had all the 45's from the greats. Sam Cooke was one along with the great Brook Benton, Platters, Drifters and Jerry Butler. To many to name. I am white and my mother didn't play that mess where I couldn't have a record because the artist was black. I am thankful for that. I grew up well. Who knows my mother who was a big Sam Cooke and Brook Benton fan, may be hanging out with them now. I am sure that Elvis is among them.
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Oct 18 '07
12:38 pm PDT
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Dr. Muhammad Speaks (Reply to this comment)
by cookefan
Hello to all who visit this site out of curiosity, love and or respect to the greatest singer who ever lived. Sam Cooke.
I enjoyed reading what was said here and was quite surprised to see my pathology report review also being quoted here as has been done in other places, most notably, the new book "Our Uncle Sam" by Eric Greene.
I felt compelled to register at this site to offer my input on the wild speculation that the Nation of Islam (NOI) had anything to do with the death of Sam Cooke.
As a former member of this group who understands the unique place it holds in the imagination of the public and the scorn of the media, let me say something very, very clearly to address this theory. Its just ridiculous. Its the wildest of the wild speculation and serves only to further muddy the waters of truth. It has been said that if you want to ensure the success of a conspiracy, then you should spout off as many wild theories as you can to keep the public confused.
The NOI has been blamed for just about everything and anything including the Oklahoma Bombings and 9-11. Its just incredible to me that anyone could think that Sam Cooke could have peeved off this organization enough for them to go ahead and murder him. True, he was close to both Malcolm and Ali, but much closer to Ali. He visited the mosques on occasion and picked up Muhammad Speaks to read like anyone else.
There is no evidence to suggest that he was funding Malcolm X' defection or was about to. I mean, just think about it. What would the NOI have to gain by killing a number one Black pop and soul star? As a matter of fact, Sam was loved by the muslims. Prove me wrong. Find one negative comment about him from the NOI. In fact, Herbert Muhammad, Elijah Muhammads son,and Ali's manager, was extremely fond of Sam Cooke and even attended his wake with Ali.
Ask any of Sams famly if they think the NOI was involved and you wil get looks of just disbelief at the absurdity of the question itself. No, no, no, lets keep the focus on what really happened that night in December in Los Angels. Sam Cooke was lured to a location close to the Hacienda Motel, he was savagely beaten and maybe even tortured. He was executed and transported to the Hacienda and then was framed, and defamed in the worst kind of way.
No, dont even consider the NOI, but yes, consider Johnny Morrisette, that long time buddy of Sams who cried out at Sams funeral begging his forgiveness...ask him what he knows about that night, ask Barbara Cooke why she really stopped the investigation that Allen Klein had authorized. Ask the LAPD where the original evidence from the case including pics and the actual gun has mysteriously dissapeared to, and ask yourself, if I wanted to incriminate someone else for a crime I had just commited, would I not leave obvious and blatant evidence behind...like a Muhammad Speaks?
The case itself will probably never be solved. The parties involved are all dead. What holds water and is supported by what is known as fact is that Sam Cooke was an incredible threat to the status quo of an industry rife with thugs, gangsters and murderers.
He enraged a lot of people with his independence and non-conformity. He had to not only be stopped, he had to be anhilated, dragged through the mud and completely destroyed as an image of strong Black male taking charge.
This was so successful, it became, for many years, an act of defiance just to mention this brothers name in a positive way. Only within the past 5-6 years has Sam been getting anything near what he is due from the general public and his contemporaries.
The worst part of all this, in my opinion, is that a good man, Elijah Muhammad, and his followers in the NOI, who inspired Sam, would have their good names smeared and their many good works dismissed based on wild and irresponsible speculation. Lets keep it real.
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Sep 23 '07
12:21 am PDT
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Response to brotherman's question on Jul 16 '03 (Reply to this comment)
by dpac
I am only now reading your comments on this matter and you have pointed to some interesting scenarios. I think these scenarios need to be explored, especially the one I mention below.
Thanks for asking! You were right to ask after all these years. I am also questioning the results of the investigation.
I am from South America and only became fully aware of this matter after viewing Sam Cooke's Legend DVD and reading the information which I gathered from the Internet.
I was born a year before the death of this great singer but grew up hearing his music and have always loved his voice. I thought back then that he was a great singer but now that I have grown and am continuing to listening to and study his music more carefully, I think that he was the greatest singer to have lived.
It's now 40 years since he was killed and people are still questioning this matter. Why? Because they want to know the truth - what really happened?
However, my gut feeling tells me that he was murdered by some of the people around him because he intended to make a great leap into the world of Producing/Recording for other people and was perhaps about to relinquish business ties with them. Such a move would have angered them, therefore, they wanted to make an example of him to show the other black singers that if they should try to follow this route they would suffer the same faith.
I think that the Police Report was seriously flawed. As far as I can see, the matter wasn't even investigated. In those times, the Civil Rights struggle was going on and it is clear for all to see that the Police didn't take the matter seriously because as far as they were concerned, he was just another dead black man. So they concocted that sad story that they called an investigation and told it to the world. But the truth will be revealed at the appropriate time because it always does. Whatever happens in the dark must come to light - that is a fact!
Sam Cook is still loved by his loyal Fans and it is a pity that none of his family members have seriously taken up this matter, even now! It isn't too late. The Civil Rights struggle has ended, and we all need to know the truth. Therefore, Fans, Friends and Family Members request a re-open of this case/investigation. We owe this to him!
Thank you.
dpac
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Sep 06 '07
7:23 am PDT
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Uncle Sam (Reply to this comment)
by fanofsam
Hi,
I would like to say it has been 40 yrs,since
Sam Cooke death.
One of the stories that i heard was from my
grandma.
"Sam Cooke was with some women,he was in bed
with her.Her man caught them.& the man shot
him & he fell over balcony& died".
Mr.Sam Cooke, you are MISSED very much.
My favorite Sam Cooke song's:"You send me,
"Chain gang","Try a little tenderness",A
change is gonna come"and "Man ain't that good
news".
rest in PEACE!!! Uncle Sam
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Mar 23 '06
9:09 am PST
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I Must Admit... (Reply to this comment)
by sam-pro
...that when I first read this review, I found it disturbing as I always thought that Sam Cooke was shot by a prostitute and that was that! I'm not sure I agree with your assessment but you do pose some interesting questions. God bless...Peter
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Jul 29 '03
4:23 pm PDT
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Re: Thanks, but... (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
Cookwithane
Thank you very much for your thoughtful comment.
There is so much information out there on sam cooke, and that is what I got from the research that I did, but I gladly defer to you.
I respectfully ask you to read my part about barbra cooke marrying bobby womack again. In no way I personally suggested that barbra or bobby had anything to do with his death( in truth i said the opposite). I just put it out there only as a theory.
From just what you have written here, you have shown a knowledge that 85 percent of the cats who write about R&B and hip hop in epinions dont have. I strongly encourage you to post some reviews on epinions and show some of these young cats what the real history of the music is.
brotherman
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Jul 26 '03
3:53 pm PDT
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Great review (Reply to this comment)
by matthewn
I have a couple of Sam Cooke songs, even though they are old, I still like them anyways. My favorites are 'Wonderful World' and 'Dancing the Night Away' It seems like the music then was better than it is today, but I digress.
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Jul 26 '03
1:09 pm PDT
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Thanks, but... (Reply to this comment)
by cookwithane
Dear Brotherman,
Thank you very much for your take on the events. I very much agree with your overall opinion. The truth is not known and needs to be investigated. Sam Cooke did die, but not as the "1964 police report and 1964 media reported".
Like there report there are some inaccuracies in your Epinion. Sam and Barbara's son Vincent was the child who drowned in their swimming pool while Sam was in the studio, not any of his daughter's.
I do not know how you can draw any conclusion about Barbara's quick marriage by her young daughter (at the time) later marrying her new husbands younger brother.
Please do not fret about my criticism, there are others who were paid a lot of money to write Sam Cooke's biography that have many inaccuracies, including the misspelling of Sam's mother's name.
Any pressure that can be brought to bear through the media to re-open the case of the "dead black man with the red ferrari" is great in my opinion. (please note that was the original police description not mine).
Sam Cooke was definitely a man far ahead of his time. His contributions to the industry go largely unrecognized. Sam was a great producer and business executive in addition to being the "number 2 selling RCA artist" at the time of his death.
How can you they make the major motion picture of the life of Sam Cooke without uncovering the truth about his death?
A Change Is DEFINITELY Gonna Come.
Keep up the good work Brotherman
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Jul 24 '03
11:25 pm PDT
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Re: What Writer's Block? (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
man I havent even scratched the surface of what I can do jim.
just you wait.
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Jul 19 '03
3:54 pm PDT
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Re: Write More Brotherman.. (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
im tryna get the led out playa, just trying to get the creative led out/
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Jul 19 '03
3:54 pm PDT
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Re: Re: I thought (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
you are welcome
and you are still fly.
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Jul 19 '03
3:53 pm PDT
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Re: I thought (Reply to this comment)
by brotherman
honestly steve, i dont know exactly what happened, but all I know is that the cops story aint true.
thanks for dropping by
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Jul 19 '03
3:53 pm PDT
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What Writer's Block? (Reply to this comment)
by 29th_Candidate
I recently saw a special on MTV that focused on the Sam Cooke shooting. You're right. Talk about suspicious circumstances....
Your theory seems to have merit, by my reading of it. (I'm hazy about the following facts, so correct me if I'm wrong:) Cooke had taken the business bull by the horns; set up his own production company so the record industry parasites wouldn't have a way to leech onto any more of his profits, right? Sounds like the record executives needed to make an example of "the uppity boy who didn't know his place."
I think the inspirational drought is over, Robert.
Happy 25th,
--29th
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Jul 17 '03
8:47 pm PDT
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Very Well Done (Reply to this comment)
by updateghost
But just remember... black and white don't exist. :)
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Jul 17 '03
12:59 pm PDT
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I agree (Reply to this comment)
by patricknjacob
This is a very well written and informative essay. I wish I did know how Cooke died. The tragedy is that he didn't die as the press said -- at least I don't believe that. I don't know that your version is correct either though, although it does seem the most plausible of those that I have ever heard. I just wish we knew the truth and could therefore give this man more of the respect that he so richly deserves.
~Melinda
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Jul 17 '03
5:50 am PDT
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Thanks (Reply to this comment)
by treeseed
The "official" explanation of Sam Cooke's death has troubled me all my adult life. I never believed it and I have hated that it seemed to just hang there, like a fetid corpse twisting in the wind, nobody to come and cut it down, just letting its stink wash all over the life of one of the most important and talented artists to ever live. I am very grateful for your essay and for you putting the questions and the truth out there. Terrie
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Jul 17 '03
5:33 am PDT
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Write More Brotherman.. (Reply to this comment)
by thevoid99
We need you man. Great piece by the way.
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Jul 16 '03
7:55 pm PDT
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Re: I thought (Reply to this comment)
by kris-kochanski
Sam Cooke's always been my favorite R&B singer although his songs depress me to no end. My favorite is "Smoke Rings."
Anyway, I never knew the story about his death. Thanks for writing this.
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Jul 16 '03
2:55 pm PDT
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I thought (Reply to this comment)
by Stephen_Murray,  in Music
that the official version was meant to promote his (superb) recording of "Frankie and Johnie"! I own but have never read the biography and only heard his recordings after his death (starting with "A change is going to come").
I don't think that the second generation marriage is strong evidence and that the closest fit is to the assassination of Malcom X--that is, Nation of Islam.
So the tragedy is the plane crash of Otis Redding, my favorite after Smokey Robinson.
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Jul 16 '03
2:23 pm PDT
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