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A Time and a Place. (Reply to this comment)
by macresarf1
Dear Chris: I had the same problem, but you can now move this review to the right place.
Garrett will do it for you.
All the best.
Alex -- Macresarf1
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Apr 07 '05
5:22 pm PDT
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re; reading comprehension (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
She left a comment (neutral) requesting that I take the time to repost the article on March 2nd in the newly created category.
She then rated the article off-topic. (No explanation of that... at all in her comment).
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Mar 07 '05
5:34 am PST
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Re: re: For the record for the record (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
Sequence of events as I see them right here in this very comment section:
Shannon leaves a nice comment explaining the OT
You jump in her face and escalate things.
What am I missing here... besides a movie I could be watching?
ObservantDoc
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Mar 06 '05
3:13 pm PST
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re: For the record for the record (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
I HAVE looked inside myself.
Shannon asked me when I have time to please move my review to the new section. I didn't have time right away... but I re-posted my review where she asked me to within a few days.
Then she rated my original post as off-topic.
It is off-topic, but we know why it is off-topic, and it's a bit silly that many weeks after the fact she decides it is important enough that she rates it off-topic.
She then takes massive offensive that I would dare to question her judgement in the matter of rating the topic off-topic. I try to explain my way of thinking and she gets more bent out of shape and then says a few things that are inacurate (not true).
You come out and fan the flames a little more because I guess it is all some wonderful of entertainment to you.
And it's free too.. lucky you.
If you go back and read through the comment posts, I think you'll understand how a molehill has turned into a mountain.
It shouldn't have. Shannon isn't a terrible person because she over-reacted.. and I'm not a terrible person because I over-reacted. You have two stubborn people who over-reacted to a very very minor situation. A mis-understanding developed that shouldn't have. I'm going to say that it all happened because of Shannon.... Shannon is going to say that happened because of me.
We are both right.
I really haven't tried to escalate it.. but I didn't just let it go and move on.
I didn't because some inaccurate things were said and I tried to clarify a few things. Instead that was taken the wrong way and Shannon got very defensive about what I said. Yet, part of what she said to me was even more inacurate and that bugged me and escalated this situation to the level of ridiculous.
What do I mean? There were two or three people who wrote reviews on this section that were asked to move them. There were at least two or three others who were NOT asked anything. She said I was not singled out. She said she asked everyone. She said she rated other people with off-topic. She did not. She didn't ask Stephen Murray at all, she didn't ask the other person I pointed out either until more than an hour after I made my comments.
One person moved their review right away. They also deleted the review that was here. I re-posted my review as requested but decided not to delete the review. Maybe one other person deleted their review here without re-posting at the other place.. I don't know for sure.
Why don't I delete this review? Because this one has been here for several weeks. The date it was posted shows it was an indeed an article that was posted prior to the OSCARS and is indeed an article that authentically attempted to PREDICT the oscars. The article I re-posted in the category that appeared AFTER the oscars had already happened has additional updates on the article to reflect what happened at the Oscars. It's a little different. It isn't actually a prediction of the Oscars because the Oscars already happened.
Actually the creation of a topic that asks people to write opinions on PREDICTING THE OSCARS that doesn't show up until after the OSCARS is over.. is an utterly unhelpful category since you can't PREDICT what has already happened. Is anyone going to write an article predicting the OSCARS after the Oscars already happened? How?
I was asked to re-post my article. I did. Shannon decided to rate my original article off-topic. It is off-topic... that's not a surprise. I say we should look at the circumstances at why I posted it, and when I posted it and decide that sometimes when people don't cooperate or work with other people in a timely fashion (meaning the folks at epinions that didn't get around to posting the 77th Oscar prediction category until after the Oscars were over), sometimes maybe it's okay to bend the rules a little so you can share your thoughts and opinions in a timely manner that makes sense.
You know, like actually posting an article that predicts the Oscars.. before the Oscars happen so that other people can read it.
I did that. I had to do it in a place that was set up to predict LAST YEAR'S oscars... because
the place to predict THIS YEAR'S oscars did not exist. There is also not a place to put articles in the movies section that don't fit into other sections. No catch-all categories.
The Place to predict THIS YEARS OSCARS showed up on March 2nd. The Oscars happened on February 27th. You can't write an opnion to predict somethin that already happened. Anyone writing on article on the topic Predicting the Oscars AFTER the Oscars happened isn't writing on the topic and isn't writing a helpful article.
As a category LEAD, Shannon has agreed to put up with all whining and complaining that people like me might do. She's also agreed to be the hall monitor too. You can be a lenient and forgiving hall monitor... or you can be a strict hall monitor. She's decided to be a very strict hall monitor. I over-reacted to that.
If it was entertaining to some of you... well I guess it is a wonderful thing to be so easily entertained.
In case it matters to Shannon... I would like to appologized that this was blown way out of proportion and if you took any actual personal offense in something I said I assure you I was merely questioning the TIMING of your judgement in rating the article off-topic and trying to understand why it was so important for you to do that. If you took my characterization to a much higher level then was intended and decided to be personally offended or felt that I was personally attacking you... I assure you that nothing I said was intended as a personal attack and I didn't mean for you take personal offense at anything you implied from what I wrote. I am very sorry if it upset you on any kind of personal level.
It was not meant to be the kind of discussion that could lead to hurt feelings at all. It was on such a small matter I didn't see how it could be blown up big enough to reach that kind of level.
It all became a big deal because that's what sometimes happens with people who are very stubborn and clash and decide to misunderstand each other and get overly defensive with each other. Sorry about my part in that.
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Mar 06 '05
11:03 am PST
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Re: for the record (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
Don't quite understand where all this drama is coming from.
Look inside yourself young Luke.....
ObiDocKanobi
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Mar 06 '05
8:44 am PST
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for the record (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
Please note:
Stephen Murray’s Review
Where's the category (77th)? How can I care about these absurd proceedings?
Feb 26 '05
The Bottom Line My final recommendation is to have "none" as an option for nominating and awarding "best song," while wishing I had the discipline not to watch an Oscarcast.
Not rated Off topic…. Not re-posted on the other category. No comments about re-posting in the other category.
BRIAN KRAKOW’S REVIEW Aka Larry M.
77th Academy Awards Predictions
Feb 23 '05
The Bottom Line Tune in to the Oscars on Sunday, February 27th at 8pm. Then come back here and tell me how bad I did.
About 43 minutes after my 8:15 p.m. comment you commented to him about moving his review and rated it off-topic. AFTER I made a comment.
Only matters because you insist you went through the category and rated other people's opinion off-topic and asked them to move their opinions.
You didn't do this like you said did.
And quite frankly, that's okay. Except you felt it important to lie about this.
Again.. I honestly didn't consider this mattered all that much. I felt your very tardy off-topic rating was a jerky thing to do.. and I told you why I thought that.. and you told me why you thought it wasn't... but I wasn't sure you understood where I was coming from.
I never said you were WRONG. I never requested that you changed your rating. And I'm not attacking you in various ways. I'm responding to what you said to me.
My review is off-topic. You'r right.
It's just the way you decided to rate it and how you felt I was attacking you.. and how you attacked me back....
Quite a lot of stuff over not very much at all.
Sorry I got so deep under your skin... shouldn't have happened. Have never had a problem or beef with you in the past. Don't quite understand where all this drama is coming from.
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Mar 06 '05
12:01 am PST
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Re: and another thing (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
You decided I’m attacking you and get bent out of shape over it and then Dr. E changes his rating to off topic and leaves his comment saying I’m being overly defensive…
Just to clarify, Chris... I'm a chick.
And I'm very glad I had this comment section on alerts.
ChucklingDoc
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Mar 05 '05
11:08 pm PST
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The End (Reply to this comment)
by Psychovant
You express you are very frustrated with trying to get categories and spaces opened up in a reasonable and timely manner.
I am. Nothing has changed since your last post.
I decided not to let epinions lack or reasonable response time RUIN the article I wrote to share with everyone here at Epinions. I waited and then posted it. I explained in my intro to the article why I was putting here. It was off-topic… obviously… but there was no other place to put it.
Again, I agree with you, it was (and still is) off-topic.
You then WAIT to rate the article so that you can give it an off-topic rating.
No waiting at all to give it the rating, Chris. The actual waiting was intended to not give you a negative rating knowing that the category would soon be live. I believe most people call that a form of giving YOU the benefit of the doubt. I also had the common courtesy to leave you a polite comment explaining that the new category was finally live. I did this for the other reviews that came up also. Oddly enough those people chose to repost or delete their reviews. Not one of them attacked me in a public forum such as this. Funny that.
You don’t notice that there are several other people who have placed articles predicting the 77th Oscars here. You don’t go ahead and rate them off-topic… Just me.
You are misguided to think that you show up on my radar enough for me to single you out as you imply. Again I will state that I also left comments for the other posts that I saw at the very same time I did for you. Some people moved them (copy and pasting their comments might I add) and some deleted them. Not one of them took it as a personal vendetta against their 77th Oscar Prediction review.
You make a comment asking me to move my article. I can re-post it .. but I don’t have the ability to move it. If I re-post it.. now that the Oscars are over, it becomes a surrealistic after the fact article. Okay I’ll add an update to it and re-post at the other place. I don’t want to take the time to reformat it with all the html codes cause it takes me a while to do it.
I made more of a polite request in your comment section actually. It is your choice to leave the review. My rating still stands. And, if you think that having a different date on your review is going to get people slamming on the brakes and not reading your review when they have just sought out that specific category I would have to strongly disagree.
I don’t want to delete the original article because it’s existed for several weeks, people have rated it.. commented on it… it is what it is.
Fine, then don’t. Move the comments to the new review… or don’t. My rating still stands and eventually the rating I left in earnest on your properly posted review will change as it is “technically” a repost of another review that is currently posted on the site (you know being “the perfect little kid in my class with the gold star on my forehead and the teacher's pet” as you so eloquently stated while you weren’t personally attacking me). We can do this however you choose, Chris.
So you rate it off-topic… I think it’s a jerky thing to do and explain why that is…. You decided I’m attacking you and get bent out of shape over it and then Dr. E changes his rating to off topic and leaves his comment saying I’m being overly defensive…
You did attack me and you did it quite personally. Are you commenting and sending the emails I recently received from you to the Epinions staff? To my CO-lead? The Epinions staff, you know, the ones that actually have the power to change these things? No? Gosh then, it would seem to me that this is an ongoing personal attack.
As a side note, I cannot stop others from commenting on your PUBLIC rants nor can I stop them from changing their ratings.
Probably am. I don’t usually WAIT a few weeks to rate someone’s article… certainly don’t WAIT to rate it off-topic.
You are being overly defensive in the simple fact that you seem to assume I have singled you of all writers in the movie category out. I extended to you the exact same courtesy I did the other posts I came across. Again I say that you are the first to take it to this elevated level. Maybe a bit overly offensive, yes.
The first couple of paragraphs of my article explains it’s off-topic. Everyone I think understood that. The people who waited a few extra days and then posted their articles… people like Stephen Murray and Ep and a few others.. they understood what I did and why I did it and if they wanted to share their opinions on predicting the Oscars before the Oscars.. they would have to break the rules and throw down an off-topic opinion to.
So what, now you want me to let everyone know that as long as they explain in the first few paragraphs that their review is ‘off-topic’ then it should be okay to post it? Don’t rate it ‘off-topic’ though, even though you know it is, because I have taken the time to explain that its ‘off-topic’. For some reason that just doesn’t fly with me.
So waiting a few weeks to proclaim it off-topic… is done because…. . . .?
Try and stay with me here because this is the very last time I am going to explain this to you. Waiting, let’s see, eleven days was done in attempt to give YOU the benefit of the doubt seeing that the proper category was not yet live. Unfortunately your conspiracy theory as to my waiting as an attempt to single just you out with an ‘off-topic’ rating isn’t true.
It was necessary because….?
For the last time – YOUR REVIEW POSTED HERE IS OFF-TOPIC.
It’s your job and responsibility to do this because even though EPS is very frustrating and didn’t create the category in a timely manner.. well after it doesn’t matter anymore.. the category finally appeared and so… now you’ve got to run back and rate it off topic…?
Actually, it is my responsibility as a category lead but, more importantly, I choose to rate the way I see fit and not the way someone repeatedly demands that I do.
Okay… you did.
Ya think?
And I think it’s a bizarre little thing to do. You didn’t do it to others… you even said you WAITED to rate it off-topic…
I did do it to others, many others. Again, you are not the special one, no matter how much you seem to want to be. And no, I didn’t say that I waited to rate it off-topic, I believe I said that I waited to rate it, giving you the benefit of the doubt, and knowing that the proper category was “in the works.” BIG, BIG difference to what you are trying to infer.
Hey Chris, your review is ‘off-topic’ there is no other way to say it. YOU even stated that it was and while I don’t believe in your theory that simply saying that you are writing an ‘off-topic’ review in the first few paragraphs warrants a rating anything other than ‘off-topic’ I will tell you that I believe that you have taken this entire thing to an unhealthy level. It isn’t personal. You aren’t the only one. You are simply the only one who chose to personally attack me (not Epinions) through public comments and private email.
Feel free to continue this but I choose not to as I feel I have adequately explained myself. Hopefully no one else will happen upon this comment section and possibly validate me as “Dr. E” did.
Being that “perfect little kid in my class with the gold star on my forehead and the teacher's pet” I feel okay in ending this by telling you to grow up and move on. I shall not return to this comment section nor will I continue to respond to your emails. Move the post… or don’t… the choice has always been yours just as the choice to rate how I deem appropriate will remain mine.
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Mar 05 '05
9:52 pm PST
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and another thing (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
You express you are very frustrated with trying to get categories and spaces opened up in a reasonable and timely manner.
I decided not to let epinions lack or reasonable response time RUIN the article I wrote to share with everyone here at Epinions. I waited and then posted it. I explained in my intro to the article why I was putting here. It was off-topic… obviously… but there was no other place to put it.
You then WAIT to rate the article so that you can give it an off-topic rating.
You don’t notice that there are several other people who have placed articles predicting the 77th Oscars here. You don’t go ahead and rate them off-topic… Just me.
You make a comment asking me to move my article. I can re-post it .. but I don’t have the ability to move it. If I re-post it.. now that the Oscars are over, it becomes a surrealistic after the fact article. Okay I’ll add an update to it and re-post at the other place. I don’t want to take the time to reformat it with all the html codes cause it takes me a while to do it.
I don’t want to delete the original article because it’s existed for several weeks, people have rated it.. commented on it… it is what it is.
So you rate it off-topic… I think it’s a jerky thing to do and explain why that is…. You decided I’m attacking you and get bent out of shape over it and then Dr. E changes his rating to off topic and leaves his comment saying I’m being overly defensive…
Probably am. I don’t usually WAIT a few weeks to rate someone’s article… certainly don’t WAIT to rate it off-topic.
The first couple of paragraphs of my article explains it’s off-topic. Everyone I think understood that. The people who waited a few extra days and then posted their articles… people like Stephen Murray and Ep and a few others.. they understood what I did and why I did it and if they wanted to share their opinions on predicting the Oscars before the Oscars.. they would have to break the rules and throw down an off-topic opinion to.
So waiting a few weeks to proclaim it off-topic… is done because…. . . .? It was necessary because….? It’s your job and responsibility to do this because even though EPS is very frustrating and didn’t create the category in a timely manner.. well after it doesn’t matter anymore.. the category finally appeared and so… now you’ve got to run back and rate it off topic…?
Okay… you did.
And I think it’s a bizarre little thing to do. You didn’t do it to others… you even said you WAITED to rate it off-topic…
Okay…
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Mar 05 '05
8:15 pm PST
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Re: regarding this (Reply to this comment)
by Psychovant
Two weeks prior to the Oscars I e-mailed Shannon and Vor and asked them to please do what they can to get the category created. 8 days before the Oscar it wasn't there.
And weeks before that I contacted Eps about this year's predictions and postmortem categories. Again, I can not add these specific categories myself as I would with a film. I did exactly what I could do and what I should have done.
People have entered contests and office pools and just have fun handicapping the Oscars and would probably enjoy reading an article about predicting the Oscars.
May I then take this time to tell all of those people entering office pools that would have looked to your review to tip the office pool in their favor, I apologize.
So what's the most helpful way that I can bend the rules and get my article out there in a timely way. By putting it here.. which is what I did. Many people rated it Most Helpful. Why? They completely understand the circumstances under which I wrote and posted my article.
Which is also why I didn't rate your review at all until after the new category was up and functional. Have you ever thought about that? I held off on rating your review, knowing it was in the wrong category, because I knew the correct place for it had not yet been implemented.
Shannon or Vor could have been unrealistically on top of things and made sure a couple of months ago the correct topic and category existed.
Shannon is but one person here and I can only do so much. It isn't unrealistic to be on top of things because for this and the 'best of' category I actually began hounding the Eps crew weeks before I received your email but it didn't seem to help one damn bit now did it?
For the last time, Chris, I did the very best that I could do. I hassled the Eps crew several times a week over the last many weeks to get this and the other categories mentioned up and functional but just as pushing the button for the elevator repeatedly in an attempt to speed up it's arrival -- IT DIDN'T WORK.
So, for the last time, I apologize for not being able to make the coders at Epinions work at a faster rate, setting bug issues, and other tasks (that they earn their paychecks for) aside to deal with my couple of requests in the movie category.
I will start taking up a collection so that just after Halloween this year I can fly down there and personally stand over whomever it looks like I can intimidate into doing my bidding until they get my specific requests added. All donations can be made to the I.A.N.Y.P.B. Foundation (I Am Not Your Punching Bag Foundation).
Extenuating circumstance or not, your review is off-topic, and I will not be bullied (as I am beginning to feel) into changing my rating because you deem it to be a "jerky thing to do."
Shannon
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Mar 05 '05
4:07 pm PST
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Re: regarding this (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
Chris... dude.. I really think you're being a bit too defensive on this issue.
Nobody attacked you or your article. It was very well written and deserves some MH action... all that is being asked was that it be moved to the right place no that the right place exists so that future readers looking for just this very thing will be able to find it.
That's all. Nothing more, nothing less.
If it's comments you wish to keep, you can copy them into your new comment section easily enough. It's been done numerous times.
Heck Chris, I'll go MH the new one myself once this one is gone....
Doc
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Mar 05 '05
11:24 am PST
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regarding this (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
Shannon rated the review off-topic.
Technically she is absolutely correct.
However off-topic has a very negative connotation to it. Shannon isn't a jerk... but rating the article OFF TOPIC I think is a jerky thing to do. A goody two shoes, go to the head of the class, teacher's pet, kind of jerky thing to do.
I spent a lot of time writing my article expecting there would be a place to post it at epinions. The category leads and epinions folks didn't make sure the proper place existed for us to post our articles.
Two weeks prior to the Oscars I e-mailed Shannon and Vor and asked them to please do what they can to get the category created. 8 days before the Oscar it wasn't there.
People have entered contests and office pools and just have fun handicapping the Oscars and would probably enjoy reading an article about predicting the Oscars.
So what's the most helpful way that I can bend the rules and get my article out there in a timely way. By putting it here.. which is what I did. Many people rated it Most Helpful. Why? They completely understand the circumstances under which I wrote and posted my article.
Shannon or Vor could have been unrealistically on top of things and made sure a couple of months ago the correct topic and category existed. I-don't-blame-them.
I also made the suggestion and I'll make it again that a catch-all topic be created.. called:
OSCAR PREDICTIONS.
Then if someone is asleep at the wheel and we don't get a 78-or-79th-or-80th-Academy Awards category we have a catch-all category articles can to into it. The correct category didn't appear until AFTER the oscars were over.
Shannon could have left no rating if she couldn't bring herself to rate the article.
My introduction to the article explains things very well. the title of the article let's people know exactly what is going on.
So as I said.. rating this article off-topic... was a jerky thing to do. It was not a completely incorrect thing to do.. and Shannon herself is not a jerk....
Hope that I'm being very clear here and no one will try to say that I'm attacking someone.
I'm not.
My article in a way was attacked... as I've explained. And I think under the circumstances... and that's the key .. under the circumstances... it didn't deserve the special attention from shannon that her off-topic rating gives to it.
If we can't have some degree of understanding and we can't have a little bit of flexability around here.. then I'm sure not interested in being part of the community at all.
I don't get the impression based on this little incident that's the case... but if folks want to blow it up out of proportion...
knock yourselves out.
Again.. the rating in my in my humble opinion--under the circumstances-- should not have been made.
No personal attack was made against Shannon. I question her judgement in regards to the small matter of her rating...
That's it.
Bye.
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Mar 05 '05
11:01 am PST
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Re: Re: harsh harsh harsh... (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
Gotta side with Shannon on this one... and that is not sucking up. We've disagreed before, but this time she's absolutely correct.
There was nothing mean spirited at all in her rating or her comment. It was a very nice comment, actually. All she asked you to do was move it now that the correct place was there.
I'm thinkin there was no reason for the attack, Chris....
Doc
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Mar 05 '05
10:33 am PST
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Re: harsh harsh harsh... (Reply to this comment)
by Psychovant
Do you attack every person that rates your reviews in a manner in which you disagree with?
If I were looking for 76th Oscar predictions and read your review it would not be helpful to me in the slightest, I believe that is known as being 'not helpful'. Knowing that Epinions did not have the category up in time I gave you the benefit of the doubt and simply rated off-topic, asking you to move it where people would see it for the year you intended it, and left a comment explaining my reasoning.
Now that I think on it, you are right, that was a pretty jerky thing to do when all I really needed to do was not take anything into consideration and rate the review how I saw fit.
Shannon
PS,
You would have held onto my respect had you of chosen to question me through email before your public attack. Matter-of-fact the name-calling in general is completely unwarranted.
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Mar 05 '05
10:14 am PST
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harsh harsh harsh... (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
Please don't be a JERK and rate this off-topic
when we all know there wasn't a category for this to be posted in until several days AFTER the Oscar night.
I requested that a place be created for the OSCAR about 14 days before Oscar night... because no one remembered to create a place.
I even suggested that a generic OSCAR PREDICTIONS CATEGORY BE CREATED to avoid having to rely on anyone at Epinions to create yearly places in time to be useful.
8 days before the Oscars I threw down my predictions here. Several people followed suit.
I've now copied the article with articles to the new category... but many many people read and reviewed and commented on the article here.
My schedule is very very busy and hectic and it took me a few days to the create a second copy with some updates for the just created category.
that is ALL.
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Mar 05 '05
9:24 am PST
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... (Reply to this comment)
by Psychovant
Yes, another year and Epinions was a little slow in adding the Oscar category but it is up and can be found here:
http://www.epinions.com/pr-Academy_Awards-77th_Academy_Awards_Predictions
I'm hoping you'll take the time to move your post so that it will be there for people searching for the 77th Oscar picks.
Shannon...
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Mar 02 '05
7:06 pm PST
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Thanks for the feedback!!! (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
Thanks epogurl.
I actually wrote this about 2 weeks ago.
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Feb 19 '05
5:51 pm PST
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Yikes!!! (Reply to this comment)
by ChrisJarmick
Duh... Counting Crows yes... thanks I'll fix that.
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Feb 19 '05
4:24 pm PST
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Where is the category? (Reply to this comment)
by epogurl
I know what you mean. I was all set to write a prediction thing but they don't have a category set up. Maybe I'll join your rebellion and post one here too.
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Feb 19 '05
3:25 pm PST
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Just one thing (Reply to this comment)
by pmills1210,  in Movies
"Accidentally In Love" is by the Counting Crows, not the Black Crowes. Still, I would like to see that song get it. Thanks for sharing!
Sincerely, Pat
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Feb 19 '05
1:32 pm PST
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