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Re: It seems to me--- (Reply to this comment)
by djtheory
I must politely disagree. The establishment clause was intended to erect a wall of separation between church and state. Indeed the very phrase "wall of separation" came from Thomas Jefferson himself, in his famous letter to the Danbury Baptist Association. He also did not believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ and edited the Bible to take out all mentions of miracles and other mystical events. The Founding Fathers, in general, were students of the Age of Reason and knew the dangers of state-endorsed religion. Religion was considered a private matter, hence "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...".
I also personally believe that while it is not possible to completely separate the two, it certainly is desirable.
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May 27 '07
10:40 am PDT
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Great essay... (Reply to this comment)
by djtheory
I agree with all of your points. I believe that democracy in any nation MUST be an internal event. It cannot be forced upon others by armed conflict or sheer political will. And as you point out true democracy takes many forms. Witness the election of Hamas, certainly not what Bush, Rice et al. expected.
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May 27 '07
10:29 am PDT
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It seems to me--- (Reply to this comment)
by gaviidae
---that the key concept is "the consent of the governed."
Interesting to note how the "establishment clause" of the US constitution has evolved in the minds of many to the total and complete "seperation of religion and politics." That of course is utterly unachievable, not necessarily desireable, and not at all the meaning of the US constitution.
It is prohibited to "pass any law with regard to the establishment of a state religion," and that's one of the great provisions of the US constitution. Political attitudes of citizens will always be influenced by their religion, whether fundamentalist or atheiist----and probably vice versa!
Excellent essay!
Gavia
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Mar 12 '07
8:31 am PDT
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Missing your excellent yarns (Reply to this comment)
by webguy
On the sights of Australia...I hope you keep it up!
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Oct 21 '06
7:28 pm PDT
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Re: !#%&/! (Reply to this comment)
by SMITHSWOODSIDE
hey Doc
That's about the only bluddy thing I don't do in this bluddy country - and now I've got to fix that!!!
gggrrrr :)
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Sep 09 '06
6:53 am PDT
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!#%&/! (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
Yo! Peter!
Tell your gummint to get their freakin website running right. I've tried tooo many times now to fill out the online visitors Visa applicationn only to be told to try back later.
Ayeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
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Sep 06 '06
5:02 am PDT
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Great essay... (Reply to this comment)
by lammet
...with very many truths. Democracy indeed does not mean the same to all. Even as its concept originated in the 5th century BC in ancient Athens -that every citizen had the right to elect and be elected- its application was bizarre: only 'free' men were permitted those rights; thousands of slave citizens had the rights of, er, slaves. Today it would be unthinkable for a society that calls itself democratic to have (officially) two classes of citizens.
But then, one can't really force an arrangement on people. They have to adopt it. And especially for any libertarian system to work without abuse, education is of the essence. Are any of the self-proclaimed crusaders of democracy aware of the elementary fact that forcing it on people before they are ready to adopt it is equivalent to giving a Neanderthal a loaded Magnum 44? (But of course they are; the AngloAmericans did not invade Iraq to liberate its people. It is the oil, stupid).
-Vasilis
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Sep 05 '06
1:40 pm PDT
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Thanks for the (Reply to this comment)
by 1truluv
History lesson. I never knew that Australia was the 'dumping ground' for criminals! Great write!
Louise
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Aug 18 '06
3:58 am PDT
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Monarchies (Reply to this comment)
by alocsin
I wouldn't mind living in an absolute monarchy if I could be the queen!
;)
Aurelio
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Jul 09 '06
8:51 am PDT
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Re: Democracy is the worst form of Government (Reply to this comment)
by shopaholic_man
I would like a copy of your comment. Could you please make it leather bound, with my name engraved! Hah! great stuff, back in college ( a long time ago) I wrote a paper on the multinationals in the 70s. Truly made me wonder who was "in charge" of the world.
Shopaholic_man another crazy consumer in the land of the free (where nothing actually is free, although some items are complimentary with your purchase)
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Jun 27 '06
5:42 am PDT
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Re: Democracy is the worst form of Government (Reply to this comment)
by SMITHSWOODSIDE
It just so happens I know personally one of our newest members b46680.
Anyone who can write with the alacrity and fervour shown in this little diatribe is someone to watch and I commend to all his first epistle...that should be out very soon.
Great start b46680
Peter
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Jun 26 '06
6:47 pm PDT
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Democracy is the worst form of Government (Reply to this comment)
by b46680
So says Winston Churchill. He goes on to say "but its better than all the others." I agree that Australia is unique in its background, and that the British heritage mingled with Irish rebellion has tended to create a fiercely independent spirit. But all that's in the past. Today's Aussie has evolved into a designer clone created by multinational corporations as a customer for product he or she doesn’t need to satisfy a desire he or she never had.
The Republican debate is a microcosm of tactical inertia. It matters little to the Corporate Machine what Brand Name their consumer drones have tagged themselves with providing such tag doesn’t affect their spending habits.
Uniqueness is a desirable quality in so much as it allows Marketers to play on its selling points. This to generate smugness and self satisfaction which in turn allows the seed to be cultivated that such self satisfied smug consumer clones deserve the latest gimmick or gizmo.
If you think that Governments run nations, ask yourself how much money you have shelled out for fuel in recent months. Examine the inflationary struggle and wonder why it is that you can afford to buy the latest “whatever” – provided that you have managed to keep your credit rating clean and your employment contract isn’t shaky.
By all means introduce Democracy into the world. It is Man’s God Given right to determine his own destiny and not cow tow to dictators. Black white yellow or any shade within the spectrum have the possibility of entering the Hive of the Consumer World. All that’s needed is a credit rating and the ability to be manipulated. ( It should be noted that poorer nations escape the invitation to become drones to the multi national Queen Bee’s Hive by virtue of being of no corporate use)
So thank your luckies that you were born in the world of dollar scented honey and get back to work.
BUY BUY.
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Jun 26 '06
6:24 pm PDT
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Bravo Bravo Well Said! (Reply to this comment)
by pantazis5
I enjoyed this commentary. We have no right to force our belief's on others. All country's are unique, have unique history to be proud of and should be treated respectfully.
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Jun 24 '06
6:48 am PDT
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The West... (Reply to this comment)
by vicfar
should clean up its own act before trying to teach democracy to the Middle East!
Popular vote is too thin of a requirement for a democracy, and beyond that, each Western democracy, the US first in line, blends democratic institutions with profoundly undemocratic ones. It would be nice to let the new republics create their own blend...
V.
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Jun 03 '06
11:42 am PDT
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Nice (Reply to this comment)
by gothicdreams
writing...I love historical standpoints and articles. Looking forward to more. Stop by and check out one of my reviews when you get a chance.
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Jun 01 '06
9:44 pm PDT
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Re: Politics and Religion... (Reply to this comment)
by drdevience
It's funny how many Americans are convinced that we are the right system for the entire world..
Oh Echo... for the luva Odin don't get me started... LMFAO
From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish.
Hear! Hear!
*waves to Peter*
(I owe ya an email.. awaiting final word from Lars company as to when...)
SvenskaDoc
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May 29 '06
3:48 am PDT
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What a day! (Reply to this comment)
by grandgram
Two reviews from my favorite people in one day, first Granniemose drinking beer and now Smithy spouting democracies or republics. I agree to each his own and in their own way. The world is full of controlling people and you have made some good points. It is the dictators that seems to cause all the upheaval and the do gooders who try to clean things up.
Life goes on as the world turns!!!
Nice to see you alive and kicking.
Letta
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May 28 '06
5:08 pm PDT
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Peter - (Reply to this comment)
by Granniemose
Nice to see you here again, and with your usual words of wisdom.
I agree with you - No way is "right" for every area or for that matter every person. I think the biggest challenge facing our country today is the whether the citizens and power brokers are willing to learn from our dreadful mistakes, and attempt to rectify them and never, ever, repeat them.
Virginia
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May 28 '06
4:51 pm PDT
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To quote an old movie: (Reply to this comment)
by webguy
"From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish. Silence! In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check. Furthermore, all children under 16 years old are now... 16 years old!"
--change of government in "Bananas", by Woody Allen.
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May 28 '06
1:12 am PDT
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To quote an old movie: (Reply to this comment)
by webguy
"From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish. Silence! In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check. Furthermore, all children under 16 years old are now... 16 years old!"
--change of government in "Bananas", by Woody Allen.
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May 28 '06
1:12 am PDT
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speaking for the US (Reply to this comment)
by shopaholic_man
The United States, one of the biggest pushers of democracy, is technically a REPUBLIC, although most US citizens forget that. I'm not sure what countries qualify as a TRUE democracy. Interesting piece for a VH here, but not enough detail for a thesis!
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May 27 '06
6:47 am PDT
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Politics and Religion... (Reply to this comment)
by BeastieGirl
inevitably get me in a fight, however, I think you had some great points:
Your scribe contends there is no such thing as a “best system”, or the “right system”.
It's funny how many Americans are convinced that we are the right system for the entire world... interesting stuff...
-Echo
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May 27 '06
5:27 am PDT
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