MomoForce's baby brother that also works on the PS2
Written: Apr 13 '03
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Product Rating:
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Pros: Probably the best value of ALL PC wheels made in the FFB category
Cons: slop in the wheel shaft, lightweight pedal base, WALL BRICK POWER (I hate them things!)
The Bottom Line: No better value for the money in PC wheels. Plastic build 'cheapness' sins are more than offset by it's price point and internal quality that has lasted.
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| psykosis_fc's Full Review: Logitech WingMan Formula Force Wheel And Pedals Se... |
Let me start be saying next month will be this wheels 3rd anniversary. That's 3 years. 36 months. I play ALOT of racing sims from GrandPrix Legends to the new GTRacing mod for F12k2 and have turned more than a few laps in practically ALL racing games on the PC and PS2 platforms in that time. Needless to say, this wheel has gotten alot of use. Not only on the PC side of things but on my PS2 as well. To give you some idea of how much use this wheel has seen, I've logged *over* 22,000 in-game miles in GranTurismo3 at least 1/2 of which were with this wheel. I've turned *over* 2500 laps in GTR2002 since January (when I reloaded), and probably 1000 or more before then. All on the LogiFFGP. I've also owned quite a few wheels--Sidewinders, Thrustmasters, Saiteks--all have either broken, had pots go out or just plain sucked. All but the FFGP.
Those two examples alone should give you some indication at the amount of time that I've spent using this particular wheel, and that's not including the time spent turning laps in GPL, NFS:Porsche and SCGT to name but a few more examples. Needless to say, I think I've got a pretty good handle on what this wheel is and is not.
Prior to buying the LWFFGP, I had the original LogiForceFeedback--the all-red one that everyone in the GPL community seems to love. I liked it alot too, but sadly it was not USB compatible and had to go when I switched to WinXP as my full-time OS. (Side note: if you can find the USB version (gameport cable with USB dongle), it's a *very* worthwhile investment of $50-70!)
Value
What can I say? I paid $130 for this new, and honestly I've never felt bad about even that price. With prices running today around $50 (cheaper online, but remember shipping), and I would unreservedly say "buy this tomorrow!". I've talked about 4 people who were marginally interested in driving games to get this wheel when the price dropped below $70, and all four are now sim-addicts spending more than 5 hours a week driving online. There simply is no better wheel on the market that's as well built, provides as good control and generally works as well as the Wingman Formula Force. Period.
Quality/looks
While this wheel felt pretty flimsy when I first got it, particularly the pedals, it's definitely stood the test of time. Primary complaints are about the general "plastikey" feel of the while kit. The housing creaks when you squeeze it, the pedals are shockingly lightweight and generally looks and feels like more of a cheap MadCatz console peripheral then a quality PC wheel. While the clamps are fairly effective, the tightening screws (and really, the whole thing) are built of really not-so-great plastic lending again to a less than sturdy, not so high quality product. there are rubber inserts along the sides of the wheel (the red parts), but they are more there for looks than any ergonomic or grip value as your hands don't really rest on the rubber. Does that make this wheel total crap? Keep reading...
Ergonimics
While this wheel looks decidedly less like a 'real' steering wheel than say, the Logi MomoForce, it has a *very* nice molded feel to it. Your index and middle fingers naturally fall on top of the shifters, there is a perfectly place releif in the face of the wheel for your thumbs and none or the four buttons require you to move your hands from their 9 and 3 O'Clock positions to reach. The microswitches themselves provide fairly good feedback with a positive indent click when depressed--not an old-school IBM keyboard type of click, but definitely more pronounced than a membrane type of microswitch for sure.
Pedals are a mixed bag. Springs are definitely too light, particularly on the brake requiring me to drive in socks to get a good touch on the controller. The angle of the pedals in general tire your ankles unless you are seated fairly upright as well--they are designed for you to sit in more of a 'kitchen chair' type of posture than a more laid back racing seat. I guess that's understandable, since most of us are sitting fairly upright at our computers. The base plate is really insubstantial in both weight and size. You definitely have to drive with both feet on the base (you should be left foot braking anyways), but if you are seated correctly, it's not that fatiguing. There is room for massive improvement in the pedals for sure.
Precision
For the most part, control is very precise and as linear as the game you are playing will allow. While the steering wheel has a limited range of motion compared to other models, in reality you only use 100degrees or so of travel at the most 95 % of the time and it's not something I've ever wished more of, or noticed at all when driving with a wheel with more degrees of rotation. The pedals are also very precise, although my impression of them after this much time is that they are less precise than the steering. The pedals also work very well in split axis, and is almost a necessity in certain games to be able to brake and apply throttle at the same time--it is also a feature that's missing in some other wheels in this price range, notably the Sidewinder series. Not being albe to run split axis pedals is a bad thing--avoid those that don't if you are serious about driving sims.
For a good part of last year, there was a substantial amount of 'spiking' in the steering axis. While the wheel was centered, it would send FULL LOCK input into the game--they lasted for only a fraction of a second, but it made driving very difficult in games that you need to run with a zero deadzone like GrandPrixLegends. Turns out that it was a driver issue, and not the wheel (thank goodness) and is no longer a problem. Another clue to the quality of the potentiometers used by Logi.
The wheel itself has a fair bit of play in the shaft due to the use of plastic bushings there. I can't condemn Logi for doing this, as sealed bearings are orders of magnitude pricier than a moled plastic peice and as far as I know ALL wheels that you buy at a computer store are like this. But there *IS* a good deal of slop there that actually rattles during bumpy effects. As far as I can tell though, this has absolutely no effect on steering sensitivity or control.
Force Feedback
This is one area where this wheel excels, even above the *MUCH* better built original Wingman FF wheel. While not nearly as powerful as other wheels, it is very good at conveying subtle details. Power is good for the big effects like bouncing off a wall or catching air in a rally sim, in my opinion, the subtle effects are much more beneficial and immersive than the 'in your face type'. In various games that have excellent FF like Viper Racing, GPL, LFS, a couple NFS games and GT3 on the PS2, you can feel things like a wheel losing grip or the amount of drift your carrying through a corner or which direction a big ole' burnout is pushing the car. For me, good forcefeedback is not only essential and helps immerse you in the game but one of the main reasons to even use a wheel and play driving games. It adds that much to the experience. While I probably race online enough to justify buying a handbuilt controller like a Ball Racing or BRD wheel, none of the high-dollar controllers are force feedback, and that alone is almost as much of a show stopper as not having split axis pedals for me.
The FFGP uses a series of gears to get the power from the stepper motor to the wheel. There is a deffinite 'crunchy' or 'grainy' feel to the wheel as you rotate it with the thing unplugged, but it's something I've either grown accustomed to, or something I've never noticed while actually in-game. It's not as smooth as a cable driven wheel for sure. But it's more than good enough for what it is. Again, it is very, very good at subtle effects. Better than most of the other non-Logitech wheels that I've tried. I'm pretty sure this is more due to the Immersion technology than ectual wheel construction, but it *is* good enough to warrent mention.
Obviously, there is no force feedback in the pedals (that could be pretty cool though). Pedal feedback is provided by springs and as I already mentioned, it's pretty weak. Those who are ambitious anough though could probably replace them with stronger items fairly painlessly though. I've never felt that they were bad enough to replace though.
Software
Personally, I think the Wingman software and profiler itself are pretty useless. While it is easy to use and provides a way to assign different effect levels for different games, I've never really found a solid need for it. Most games that I've played that need a different controller setting or button assignments are handled in-game. The profiler can actually cause fairly common system instability and should most likely not be used. However there is benifit from installing the drivers, among which is removing the 'notchyness' mentioned earlier. Another is that it adds functionality to the Game Controllers Control Panel applet such as force effect strength, effect damping and centering spring force. Also noteable is that this is where you set the pedals to run split axis, and is the only way to enable the feature. So install the software, but there's no need to actually run any Logitech software after it's installed.
Also included is the usual shovelware like SCGT, which is a pretty darn good game after the patches and updates are applied--read the review on SCGT in my profile if you are interested.
Overall
While there are more than a few shortcomings compared to other products like Logi's own MomoForce (an OUTSTANDING wheel that's now below $150 and totally worth it if you are into racing games--alot of the GP's shortcomings are addressed in the Momo. Don't be confused by the new all-black MOMORacing; it's *marginally* better than the GP, more expensive and won't work with the PS2-not worth $100), and other more expensive controllers, but you don't get what this wheel has to offer with anytheng else either. Well above average control accuracy, excellent force feedback and very good quality potentiometers that have held up to countless hours and literally years of abuse. Even after that long, it *still* feels *exactly* the same as a brand new one! Nice. While some people would rather have big paddles for the shifters, the miniscule buttons on the back of the wheel actually work quite well for me. Those with small hands might find them a bit of a reach though. My biggest gripe is that there are only 4 buttons--I'd rather have the 6 like the MomoForce, but they are well laid out and intuitive to use without taking your eyes off the screen. It also works *AMAZINGLY* well connected to a PS2 in GranTurismo3, with excellent force feedback programming provided (again) by Immersion.
Conclusion
There is no other wheel peripheral on the market that will give you the same levels of everything that the Logi FFGP does. Drivers are more stable than the Sidewinder, feedback and control accuracy are MUCH better than the Saitek or Interract, and at under $60 out the door you can hardly go wrong. If you are using an old Thrustmaster wheel, you will be shocked at how much more precise this wheel is; so much so that I wouldn't be surprised if you started playing alot more racing games. If you've never played with a wheel before, you have NO idea what you are missing. If you've never played with force feedback before, you will never be able to go back to a 'normal' wheel again.
Highly recommended at $100--a no brainer at it's current price point. The big decision really in my opinion is whether to get this, or pony up the extra $70 for the MomoForce. The Momo has MUCH better pedals and I think the FF mechanism is a little smoother--there are a load of detail differences in the two. Whether the extras in the two are worth $70 is up to you. It's about a toss up for me; but I'm still using my GP if that tells you anything.
Recommended:
Yes
Amount Paid (US$): $130
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Epinions.com ID:
psykosis_fc
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Member: Jeff
Location: Pasadena, CA
Reviews written: 42
Trusted by: 22 members
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